Hello All, After IIMA, IIMC is the next premier school to have started a 1 year MBA. I will be applying for the founding batch. So, thought it is the right time to start a thread to get all the prospective applicants on board. My prof…
Hello All,
After IIMA, IIMC is the next premier school to have started a 1 year MBA.
I will be applying for the founding batch. So, thought it is the right time to start a thread to get all the prospective applicants on board.
My profile is -
Work Ex - 6.5 yrs
Industry - HiTech (IT ofcourse!!)
GMAT - 670 (ah!! it hurts!!)
Here's the link - www.iimcal.ac.in/pgpex/
Hi Tarun,
Good to know that someone's been tracking the IIM Calcutta program (I believe they haven't advertised the course as yet). I had submitted my GMAT scores to them way back in May 2005, in anticipation of the course. They have finally announced the course. The course content gives me a feel that this is going to be an extremely rigorous and analytical course, something typical of all Indian mgmt programmes. I wish they had two admission rounds if not rolling admissions. This one long wait till September to know about your admission decision, is very difficult to plan for (if this is your favourite program and you have a constraint of doing your MBA this year itself). Finally, if the demand for IIM-A PGPX was any indication, there's going to be a mad rush for this MBA as well !!!
BTW, here's my profile:
Workex: 5.25 years (Team Lead in IT MNC)
GMAT: 700
Acads: Average
Regards,
Amit
This is the thread for Foreign MBA aspirants
Post a new thread in the CAT discussion forum.
Here's the link
http://www.pagalguy.com/cat
Cheers.
EDIT: Mods ... is it OK ...'cause they are discussing GMAT scores :confused:
IIMA's PGPX and IIMC's PGPEX are programs in direct competition with programs at INSEAD,IMD and all other one year programs ranked in the top 20 in the world.
Just take a look at the IIMA PGPX participant profile on their site.
D-uh.
When did this happen??
Many thanks for this tangent... I had been tracking the other courses offering 1 year MBA and had missed on IIMC.
Here is what I think (and fear)
IIMs happen to be a cloese community and as has happened in tha past follow IIMAs lead.Looking at the composition of IIMA_PGPX batch the IIMC would also try and admit the same profile even though the eligibility is 5yrs of work ex (IIMA_PGPX was avg 9yrs for the admit batch).
Have 2 questions though
1) would IIMC_PGPEX be better ( than ISB or IIMA_PGPEX) for someone who would like to major in finance and / or is looking for a career within the finance market in India.
2) how many of the Puys are applying for the first batch ( i am).
Please post.
PS.. IIMA_PGPX batch 2 forms are also available online.
Harsh, I suggest you have a look at the course curriculum and IIM-C's vision behind this course. I really don't think the course structure offers too much leeway for career-switchers. This course is primarily targeted at people who want to leapfrog in their current domain of work (they say they want to build CEOs.. or rather train potential CEOs). Having said that there are a number of courses in the curriculum related to finance. Sadly, going by the IIM-A precedent, the number of seats would be very less (this is not published on the site, as yet), and having been through the ISB application recently, I know very well that getting into top MBA programs in India is much much more competitive than getting into a good B-school abroad - a classic demand-supply mismatch.
I think the target audience for IIM-A and IIM-C programs is slightly different. Whereas, the former is looking for people almost ready for top-level leadership (at least seniority-wise), the latter is looking for people who can get there in 5-10 years (picked from IIM-C Dean's interview on Pagalguy).
I really don't think the course structure offers too much leeway for career-switchers. This course is primarily targeted at people who want to leapfrog in their current domain of work (they say they want to build CEOs.. or rather train potential CEOs). Having said that there are a number of courses in the curriculum related to finance.
But, CEO is a 20+ years experience profile.. unless you are a wildcard Michael Dell. And most of those who would take a PGPEX would be middle management profiles considering the IIMA_PGPX entrants workex profile. Again, the IIMC_PGPEX has a low years of experience cut off (than IIMA_PGPX) so I believe they would get a higher application rate and would end up announcing a 150+seats.
Yep, I agree that being a capsule course the modules would be pre-formatted with little customisation possible; hence getting a substancial exposure to finance would be difficult.. but the brand value which an IIMC commands I am sure there would be many organisations willing to risk hiring a fresher (to the domain) with a workex ( of say people management or relationship management or project management).. again this may be supported by a CFA for the finance wannabes (like myself).
I am v optimistic.
I think the target audience for IIM-A and IIM-C programs is slightly different. Whereas, the former is looking for people almost ready for top-level leadership (at least seniority-wise), the latter is looking for people who can get there in 5-10 years (picked from IIM-C Dean's interview on Pagalguy).
Yep, the intake expected would be from a different profile.. but the high competition is because one, any of the 1 year MBAs in India is not differentiated enough (along the career streams )and two, because as middle managers who are spending money we tend to flock to the course which has the best brand reco amongst the employers (case in point ISB or IIMA_PGPX v/s IIMB_PGSEM or IIMA_PGAM or NIDM Anand)
This is 1-0 in favour of the college; more applications less selections.
I just hope that with less fees and lesser workex cutoff the batch has a slightly younger crowd... one reason I had scored ISB over IIMA_PGPX in my reckoning was on the average age of the student batch.
I differ.
I think that the workex criteria should not come down to even 5 yrs experience.
If it does, what is the point in conducting a one year program when many ppl with that experience are already applying for another program (I mean two year program). IIMA/IIMC will be well aware that they cannot be running two supposedly two different programs where the participant profile is overlapping. Clearly there has to be a demarcation.
So, the avg experience level for the candidates for both the one year programs is expected to stay at 9+ years (may be it will even go up) so that this program is clearly for managers, or in Henry Mintzberg's words, this mgmt program is for working managers to learn mgmt through their personal work experience.
(As I said in an earlier thread, if IIMC or IIMA even lets out a single line in their program brochure that there is NO placement provided for the applicants, i am sure half if not most, of the applicant junta will run away, any way that is a different story)
Bye
I think that the workex criteria should not come down to even 5 yrs experience.
If it does, what is the point in conducting a one year program when many ppl with that experience are already applying for another program (I mean two year program). IIMA/IIMC will be well aware that they cannot be running two supposedly two different programs where the participant profile is overlapping. Clearly there has to be a demarcation.
So, the avg experience level for the candidates for both the one year programs is expected to stay at 9+ years (may be it will even go up) so that this program is clearly for managers, or in Henry Mintzberg's words, this mgmt program is for working managers to learn mgmt through their personal work experience.
(As I said in an earlier thread, if IIMC or IIMA even lets out a single line in their program brochure that there is NO placement provided for the applicants, i am sure half if not most, of the applicant junta will run away, any way that is a different story)
Bye
kundalak SaysIIMA's PGPX and IIMC's PGPEX are programs in direct competition with programs at INSEAD,IMD and all other one year programs ranked in the top 20 in the world. Just take a look at the IIMA PGPX participant profile on their site.
You got to be kidding me by comparing PGPX by any of the IIMs or ISB to be anywhere close to what is offered by INSEAD or IMD. Those courses have an umatched brand equity anywhere in the world. Ask the McKinseys and the people on Wall St. Heck ! Ask the Harvards and Whartons to whom are they loosing our their admits to.
But yes from an Indian perspective both the PGPX and ISB are courses you would love to get in for a variety of factors. In my case it is personal reasons like I am foreign relocation-averse plus have no collateral for a huge foreign loan.
Arun
I think this 5 year requirement is unjustified
(I dont have it:wink:)
IIMA only has the requirement of age. From personal experience, sometimes you learn more in life by not being anyone's slave and doing nothing or rather working for yourself
I thought B was going to do this after A but C has already started it
K
You got to be kidding me by comparing PGPX by any of the IIMs or ISB to be anywhere close to what is offered by INSEAD or IMD. Those courses have an umatched brand equity anywhere in the world. Ask the McKinseys and the people on Wall St. Heck ! Ask the Harvards and Whartons to whom are they loosing our their admits to.
But yes from an Indian perspective both the PGPX and ISB are courses you would love to get in for a variety of factors. In my case it is personal reasons like I am foreign relocation-averse plus have no collateral for a huge foreign loan.
Arun
Hey PsychoD,
I have one question. You were saying that foreign MBAs are costly but compared to ISB costs (which could be close to 16 lakhs), I find that NUS MBA or Australian MBA (including course fee and other expenses come close to the same 16 lakhs..
So, why not look at them? Just curious. You might have already done all these calculations. I think NUS has far better brand image around the world than ISB (because ISB is very much new). What do you think?
hey hey hey... yahan bhi muhabbatein
please read http://www.pagalguy.com/discussions/the-right-institutes-for-people-with-work-experience-25011159 for some insight into the mind of a regular bloke before his expensive MBA... read all the 3 pages .. but try and see page 3 for sure.
Claptonfan :: i agree that if the college does not support post qual placements then quite a few of us would decline acceptance letters....... however assuming that the college would want the admiited to get employed with a benefit post qual (good roi and thus more students later on) then IIMC would make use of it's in place placement cell for a new stream of students (practical and less expensive);
building on the same tangent--- if the placement is the end goal (it should be) then the placement cell and the college would be happy to support the admission of people who stand a chance of getting hired after the qualification ( on the bases of their previous workexperience).
You got to be kidding me by comparing PGPX by any of the IIMs or ISB to be anywhere close to what is offered by INSEAD or IMD. Those courses have an umatched brand equity anywhere in the world. Ask the McKinseys and the people on Wall St. Heck ! Ask the Harvards and Whartons to whom are they loosing our their admits to.
But yes from an Indian perspective both the PGPX and ISB are courses you would love to get in for a variety of factors. In my case it is personal reasons like I am foreign relocation-averse plus have no collateral for a huge foreign loan.
Arun
Will completely agree that IIMs do not have the brand equity that INSEAD or IMD enjoys. However, during the application process and now with a few admits including PGPX , I strongly feel that an institute can only do that much. A lot depends on what we can take back from a program and then with some luck build upon the initial breaks that any quality program will provide. Its has been mentioned zillion times on this forum that our choice of a US , european or indian school probably depends on our long term goals and personal situation. I usually find this comparison meaningless.
One has to be really good and lucky to get that $$$$ salary at IIMs / ISB , something one can expect at INSEAD/IMD. However, ROI of ISB/IIM PGPX courses makes sense if the goal is to leap frog in your current industry vertical and role. Money cant be the only criteria to decide which school is best and even if it is there is a simple truth.....All of us will earn 70% of our life time's income in the last 10 years of our working life when we are at reasonably higher positions. So take a course which can possibly prolong these 10 years to say 15. For me, IIMA PGPX is the right course on this count for a cost of Rs. 10 lacs.
Personally, I feel 5 yrs is just the right work ex. for a course like PGPX. There can be exceptions but generally one would find that smarter guys (and gals) move ahead of others in around five years and are ready to be "coached" for bigger roles. Moreover, many people drop the idea of doing MBA after 7-8 years of work ex because of personal constraints and huge opportunity costs. Around 40% of the selected junta in PGPX is coming from overseas. Its not easy leaving your current job and coming back to India to do a course which is new. Even with a IIMA brand thats a huge risk.
Who dares wins 😃
The only problem with 5 yrs work ex. is that PGPX might cannabalise the regular PGP course. Of late, the number of students with work ex. have increased in the PGP course.
Cheers
Mukul
For all the IIM lovers, please read this article in FT. Though, I would not get over excited because top 10 ranking by 2010 seems unrealistic to me.
Management: Reaching for the top 10 schools
By Khozem Merchant
Published: January 25 2006 18:30 | Last updated: January 25 2006 18:30
If you bring together Indian business leaders, a common link is
likely to be their education at the prestigious Indian Institutes of
Management. Such is the brand equity of a Masters in Business
Administration from India's six IIMs that the leading member, in
Ahmedabad, is often spoken of in the same breathless manner as
traditional centres of excellence such as Harvard Business School in
the US.
The comparison may not be entirely fanciful: in the next few months
Harvard Business School, already stacked with Indian faculty members,
will appoint a new dean. A front runner is Srikant Datar, who
graduated with distinction from IIM-Ahmedabad in 1978. If business
schools are symbols of global civil society, as Amy Gutmann,
president of the University of Pennsylvania, told Indian alumni of
Wharton Business School, then arguably IIM-Ahmedabad is in the
vanguard of globalisation in India.
"The most important element of globalisation is global mindset no
school here can match us in this regard," says Bakul Dholakia,
director of IIM-A, whose partnerships with global schools and
exchange programmes is unmatched in India.
He describes the style of tuition as intellectually tough and built
around team-based problem-solving of complex case studies. In year
one of the standard two-year MBA, students and faculty have 700 hours
of "contact in a learning situation", compared with 650 to 700 hours
over two years at a US school. "We do twice as much and it shows in
our achievement. That gives us confidence to say that we will be
among the world's top 10 schools by 2010," he says.
Many factors support IIM-A's ambitions. Foremost is a rising global
admiration for Indian management capability that can be traced back
to IIMs. From McKinsey in the US, to the smartest Indian businesses,
bosses are ex-IIM. This pedigree has turned IIMs into a prized
hunting ground for global recruiters willing to pay gold for the
best; HSBC bagged an IIM-A graduate with a salary of $152,000 last
year.
For the same reasons that have turned India into the world's leading
offshore IT-services centre, IIMs are also seen as a cost-effective
alternative to schools in North America, where applications are
falling for traditional two-year MBA courses. Fees on IIM's standard
two-year MBA are (a subsidised) Rs160,000 a year while students on
IIM-A's new one-year MBA, starting in April, will pay $18,000,
including most living expenses, compared with a bill of $100,000 at
Insead in Europe. Along with the opportunity cost, the IIM brand
value among the Indian diaspora is so strong that "they actually
believe" they can get something out of it and they do," says Arvind
Sahay, an IIM-A professor.
For its part, IIM-A is pursuing a strategy to enhance its global
engagement, but is constrained by several factors that will hold back
a full-blooded foray which in business-school terms means signing
on foreign students for full-time residential courses.
First, compensation for IIM faculty members is pegged to government
pay levels, which are paltry, making the task of getting the best
international teachers a non-starter. Second, IIMs, mostly government
subsidised, struggle to guard their autonomy from the state. This
month, India's education ministry denied IIM-Bangalore permission to
set up a campus in Singapore, arguing that domestic requirements were
more pressing than those of rich clients overseas. Two years ago, the
schools fought a bruising battle with a government that wanted to
abandon the schools' prized tradition of meritocracy for more
egalitarian entry rules.
Finally, attracting full-time foreign (especially non-Indian)
students will remain a low priority while local demand remains
intense: only 0.16 per cent of 150,000 annual applicants win a place
at IIM-A, making the school harder to get into than Harvard. Even if
the doors were fully opened for foreigners they would have to match
the exceptional academic standards of Indian entrants, which means
attaining an equivalent GMAT (graduate management admission test)
score of 700. "That can get them into Harvard or Wharton so why
should they bother with IIM-A," says Mr Dholakia.
The issue, as the school's director therefore sees it, is to boost
IIM-A's brand. Mr Dholakia, an economist plucked from IIM-A faculty
three years ago to lead the school, has not been idle. Admitting he
functions within "limitations", Mr Dholakia has focused on three
short-term instruments designed to develop IIM-A's global profile,
and one long-term tool the one-year MBA.
First, he has expanded the school's international exchange programme.
IIM-A partners 37 schools in Asia, Europe and North America. In the
last academic year, 63 foreign students spent three-months of their
MBA programme at IIM-A; 53 Indians did the same at corresponding
foreign schools. A similar number are sent on summer internships with
potential employers that usually translate into full-time placements.
The programmes do not overlap, which means that about one-third of
each intake at IIM-A spends two to three months overseas. For
students such as Chaitanya Tatineni, a second-year MBA student from
Orissa, a stint at ESCP EAP in Paris helped "dispel social
stereotypes".
Tatineni and others cite cultural integration as the most important
experience from overseas stints. This does not seem surprising given
that 45 per cent of IIM-A's intake on the two-year MBA are fresh from
undergraduate studies, while another 55 per cent arrive with a couple
of years work experience.
In contrast, overseas exchange student Omar Maldonado, from the
Dominican Republic but working as a consultant in New York before
joining an MBA programme in the city, sees his time in India as an
opportunity "to learn about India's legal system and family
businesses so I can return and work in the world's fastest-growing
economy".
Mr Dholakia is also developing faculty exchange by arranging swaps at
an institutional level and at a more personal level. The first will
see overseas academics spending, say, a sabbatical at IIM-A; the
second would bring IIM-A alumni, such as Raghuram Rajan, director of
research at the IMF, back for short-term teaching slots. This
practice is already widespread, and draws on a large community of
Indian-origin faculty in the US.
A third front is expanding short-term management programmes that the
school holds at the request of corporate customers overseas. Last
year, IIM-A ran such courses in Egypt, Thailand and China, "teaching
local executives, not expatriate Indians, and therefore building our
global brand," says Mr Dholakia.
While creating this thread I was aware that this is the forum for Foreign MBA aspirants but there was no way this thread could have been started under CAT discussion forum.
Looking at the trend, we are going to see mushromming of 1 year MBA programs in India (accepting GMAT score). Perhaps a new forum for one year MBA is required!!!
cheers
Tarun.
This is the thread for Foreign MBA aspirants
Post a new thread in the CAT discussion forum.
Here's the link
http://www.pagalguy.com/cat
Cheers.
EDIT: Mods ... is it OK ...'cause they are discussing GMAT scores :confused:
I would suggest you to contact IIMC and get the answers to your queries from the horses mouth.
And in case you manage to get a reply, please share with all of us.
Cheers
Tarun.
D-uh.
When did this happen??
Many thanks for this tangent... I had been tracking the other courses offering 1 year MBA and had missed on IIMC.
Here is what I think (and fear)
IIMs happen to be a cloese community and as has happened in tha past follow IIMAs lead.Looking at the composition of IIMA_PGPX batch the IIMC would also try and admit the same profile even though the eligibility is 5yrs of work ex (IIMA_PGPX was avg 9yrs for the admit batch).
Have 2 questions though
1) would IIMC_PGPEX be better ( than ISB or IIMA_PGPEX) for someone who would like to major in finance and / or is looking for a career within the finance market in India.
2) how many of the Puys are applying for the first batch ( i am).
Please post.
PS.. IIMA_PGPX batch 2 forms are also available online.
Hey PsychoD,
I have one question. You were saying that foreign MBAs are costly but compared to ISB costs (which could be close to 16 lakhs), I find that NUS MBA or Australian MBA (including course fee and other expenses come close to the same 16 lakhs..
So, why not look at them? Just curious. You might have already done all these calculations. I think NUS has far better brand image around the world than ISB (because ISB is very much new). What do you think?
Hi Clapton,
Here is my take on
NUS v/s MBS/AGSM v/s PGPX
-----------------------------------
NUS Wins:
(a) International environment
(b) World class facilities - and this is not a cliche'
(c) Good brand equity in south east Asia
MBS/AGSM Wins:
Same as NUS, except that the brand equity is a bit more than NUS. Moreover:
(a) Ability to get an Australian PR at the end of the course.
(b) Automatic UK HSMP visa means greater chances of employability there
ISB/PGPX Wins:
(a) For people with India-centric career plans this is the place to be
(b) Extreme enterance criteria ensures pedigree (fact even employers know)
(c) Non-collateral loans available. Remember the stress is on having collateral.
(d) Obviously no work-permit required to work in India.
(e) Culturally, Socially you are well acquainted with the market, no need to pick up something new. Especially true for marketing, sales positions.
(f) Placements vis-a-vis the NUS/NTU/AIM-Manilla or even MBS/AGSM in Aus is extremely good. You are guaranteed a good job (relatively speaking) at the ver least.
(g) Spouse if working in India, does not have any hassles for relocating and finding a job there. Intra-country transfer is always easier and less painful.
Thats about what I can remember. Just a point - Neither ISB/IIMs nor NUS have a standing in the world class MBA institutions in terms of brand equity. So on that aspect its very hard to compare them. MBS/AGSM might slightly edge out in this aspect but its too minor to play a huge factor.
Arun
Will completely agree that IIMs do not have the brand equity that INSEAD or IMD enjoys. However, during the application process and now with a few admits including PGPX , I strongly feel that an institute can only do that much. A lot depends on what we can take back from a program and then with some luck build upon the initial breaks that any quality program will provide. Its has been mentioned zillion times on this forum that our choice of a US , european or indian school probably depends on our long term goals and personal situation. I usually find this comparison meaningless.
See by that logic the best place would be Chinchpokhli Institute of Management Studies (CIMS) baaki toh we can take back from program, use luck, build upon breaks etc. etc.
J/K.No but the point if you mention ki sab apne pe depend karta hai then no point ki Wharton ho ya GLIM ho ya ISB. The whole assumption on which you are basing your argument is wrong. There is nothing left to discuss if that were the case.
One has to be really good and lucky to get that $$$$ salary at IIMs / ISB , something one can expect at INSEAD/IMD. However, ROI of ISB/IIM PGPX courses makes sense if the goal is to leap frog in your current industry vertical and role.
And why wouldn't a INSEAD/IMD not help you leapfrog in your current industry vertical and role ??
Money cant be the only criteria to decide which school is best and even if it is there is a simple truth.....All of us will earn 70% of our life time's income in the last 10 years of our working life when we are at reasonably higher positions. So take a course which can possibly prolong these 10 years to say 15. For me, IIMA PGPX is the right course on this count for a cost of Rs. 10 lacs.
Point is not so much about getting loans as much as getting non-collateral loans. For example many people get admits are not able to go to the Univ of their choice due to lack of funding. In my case I have no collateral, who will give me a loan of 30lakhs to pursue an MBA abroad ? In this way Indian schools win hands down.
Arun
Since the PGPX crowd seems to be here...
I am just wondering whether some PGPX and PGP students will sit in atleast some of the same classes?? I must say if that is true then it will definitely be a great boost to the learning levels of those in the PGP batches at A and C...
K
Has anyone started filling the application form? I had a few queries which I would like to share with all of you
1. IIMC has asked for attested/notarized transcripts from the university. I am working in Singapore, so not sure whether I will be able to arrange the same. I had requested IIMC to waive off this requirement and let me submit the photocopies of my marksheets.
2. No word limit for the essay has been mentioned in the application form.
I emailed my queries to IIMC about 10 days ago. But so far they have not responded. I sent a reminder email also but unfortunately still no response has been received.
In case you folks also have queries and get in touch with IIMC, please share the response on this thread.
Cheers
Tarun.