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    Why the new diversity and acads centric IIM admission criteria are a step in the right direction
    by Apurv Pandit in opinion, CAT, Classroom diversity, IIM admission criteria, Emphasis on academics on 01 February '12



    Not that I have spent a lot of years on the planet, but the best people I have ever worked with were broadly of two types --- they were either driven by a higher sense of purpose that they had attached to their professions early in their careers or they were just very hard working and disciplined, a quality developed and conditioned over many years.


    Prima facie, these seem like commonplace characteristics, considering how many people write such lines in resumes to describe themselves. But anybody who has ever recruited another person for a job knows how they are plain lies 99% of the time.


    Take for example, the oft-mentioned quality of being passionate about something. If somebody said that to me in an interview, I would be curious and pry further to look for evidence of the person having followed that passion for a sufficiently long time and reached a fair level of competitive expertise in it.


    It's astonishing how widely the word 'passion' is abused. 'Passion about travel' turns out to be a total of two trips to some obvious destinations, 'passionate about photography' turns out to be the ability of owning a camera and operating Photoshop, 'passion for reading' turns out to be a total of three bestseller books read in one year and 'passionate about sports' turns out to be the infinite patience required to sit in front of a TV screen. We need to travel backward in time to that cusp of our existence when the first individual successfully fooled an employer by writing 'listening to music' and 'going on long drives' as hobbies and isolate him from the rest of our race.


    Similarly, claims about being 'hardworking' become questionable when little about one's past substantiates it --- especially academic scores for somebody who is too young to have worked in a fulltime job.


    That explains the wild popularity of the Common Admissions Test (CAT) of the Indian Institutes of Management (IIMs) until a couple of years ago. For those with modest acads in school and college, it was a chance at academic redemption. Like modular furniture, one could mix-and-match a range of test percentiles and short-term activities and projects to give a facelift their academic suitability without really having to be the person that b-schools were looking for.


    Average past academics? Score a hit-and-run high percentile in the CAT. B-schools want experience of giving back to society? Join a community service programme to the extent of garnering a certificate. Have no hobbies? Manufacture something up. Something as fundamentally important as being aware about the world around us has become trivialised to a subject called 'general knowledge' that can be 'learned' at the last minute using 'GK guides'. None of this of course means that someone is hardworking, altruistic, interesting or aware, it is merely constructing a strawman of what one is not.


    That this 'strawman farce' has worked at job and admission interviews is really a sign of how urgently business in India was trying to scale up before the recession of 2008 poured cold water over it.


    Two things have changed since then. First, the economic recession has transformed the job market fundamentally, as it has the way companies think about work. Indian companies now want more inclusive workforces with more women and more diversity. Second, the best b-schools in India have nearly doubled their intakes (to make up for seats transferred to the reserved class quotas) just at a time when companies were changing their requirements. Not only do they have to make more number of students employable, they are having to do so at a time when employment is looking like it would be a buyer's market for a long time to come.


    Our top b-schools, IIMs included, have been responding to this by changing their admission criteria to place more emphasis on past academic scores and granting measured walkovers to non-engineers and women. In my view, this is a step too late but a step in the right direction nevertheless. For a skill that relies so much on developing good judgment and getting work done with people who are not necessarily like yourself, it is shocking how unidimensional our topmost management education classrooms are, filled as they are often with 90% or more engineers. In order to prepare for working in diverse workforces, studying in diverse classrooms and learning to make peace with diametrically opposite viewpoints --- the 'poets' and the 'quants' --- is a logical first step.


    One common lament about the IIM admissions system before 2009 used to be that it was the world's largest annual rejection exercise. Rather than rewarding candidates for what they were, the system was a brute-force pruning routine that started with 2.5 lakh and ended with 1,500, with every stage obsessing more over rejecting applicants based on a percentile here, a wrong answer there than rewarding qualities in people found at the edges.


    The new emphasis on past academics for the first time rewards those candidates who have demonstrated the ability to be consistently hardworking throughout their pre-adult life. Not once during CAT, but four times --- through class 10th, 12th, graduation AND the CAT. Our school evaluation systems may have many flaws and getting good marks in class 10th and 12th may be a saga of mugging up, but everyone forgets that even the mugging up does not come free, it requires hard work and discipline, and it is this demonstrated quality of being a reliable and sincere operator that the b-schools have begun rewarding.


    One comes across a lot of opposition to the newfound importance placed on academics by the IIMs, with the common refrain being that 'the candidates have been punished for their past sins'. But those who are in the business of hiring know that past evidence of performance is usually a safer bet than the one-hit-wonder promise. If someone has been a slacker for 20 years, chances that an isolated 99 percentile in the CAT is going to change the basic personality type are low. In a country that has ambitions of competing internationally, the industry needs to and should be entitled to placing these safer bets.


    In all the anger directed at the 'unfairness' to candidates, the issue is rarely looked at from the other side. If as a country we have invested billions and decades in creating excellent institutions of learning with a high-quality professorial class, aren't these institutes also entitled to admitting those students who are more likely to do justice to all that investment, purely from a resource utilisation point of view?


    Published research studies such as those by Dr Baldev Sharma of Delhi's International Management Institute have shown that there is very low correlation between CAT scores (during the paper-pencil days) and actual academic performance inside b-school (The Common Admission Test: An Empirical Test of its Validity, Baldev Sharma and V Chandra, Journal of Educational Planning and Administration, October 2010). Some b-schools have gone a step ahead and performed informal studies to find that there is high correlation between one's past academic scores and b-school GPA.


    I therefore think that the underlying premise of cutting the CAT down to size and rewarding candidates with consistent performance since childhood is a sound one. Admission processes should further be opened up to be more inclusive, that reward genuine interests and sincerity as demonstrated by past history and ends the 'strawman farce' so prevalent among our younger population. It would go a long way in having a trickle-down effect in which youngsters --- at least those who are interested in a great education in the future --- do more with their lives at a younger age and stop treating themselves like modular furniture.


    At the same time, b-schools should phase themselves out of the 'weightage obsession' and begin subjective evaluation of candidates. Applicants should be asked to substantiate their need for great management education in essays or interviews and be asked to back their claims up with past evidence and depth. On their part, b-schools should start looking at admissions in terms of 'composing' a diverse class rather than 'selecting' it. They should employ younger professorial talent in their admission teams who are more in tune with the current generation and take genuine interest in understanding the story of each applicant rather than a bunch from the old guard who view candidates as cattle from the millennial generation to be selected on the basis of trivialised numerical measures and cutoffs.

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    abhi.iimb, UncouthYouth & 176 others like this
    • Page 21 of 22  
    • rahul4 @Apurv - Please consider this real life situation - I have a friend and this guy was a very good sportsperson..he has represented his state cricket team for 4 consecutive years..has a whole lot of awards,achivements etc..He gave CAT got an average percentile..of 98.xx..he wasnt called by any iim's..because he had scored just 65 and 70 in his 10th and 12th because then he was busy chasing his dream..and was passionate about it....Now the other real life story... The Indian Hockey team Player Viren Rasquinha wanted to start his own sports Business..and he was admitted to ISB,Hyderabad..He wasnt great in 10th and 12th ..you can see his interviews...But still got through ISB..even when he had 10th and 12th.All the IIM'S are doing according to me is monopolising MBA..thats not gud...Apurv..request you to reply to that
      #401 • 03 Feb '12 Like
    • Apurv @rahul4 - Generalising on the basis of exceptions is a logical fallacy. The entire point of the article was that for the first time the IIMs are 'selecting' people as opposed to the multi-stage rejection system of the past. The admissions process should be opened up further to include essays and extraordinary achievements, etc too but this is a good start. Whether the IIMs develop further on this remains to be seen, I hope they do.
      #402 • 03 Feb '12 Like
    • rohitpal @ apurv - can we plz have the list of recently active threads back. it is kinda difficult to use pagalguy otherwise :( i hope u understand what i mean :(
      #403 • 03 Feb '12 Like
    • Apurv @rohitpal - Until it's back, use this - http://www.pagalguy.com/forum/search.php?do=getnew
      #404 • 03 Feb '12 Like
    • first_timer how are the IIMs "selecting" people now? it's still a rejection system, with the 10/12/grads scores being the rejection criteria instead of the CAT score, with a few grace marks thrown here and there to some sections of the students to bring diversity. The number of applicants they interview are still more or less the same. And one more point: since the article has stressed so much on the point of almost no correlation between percentiles and bschool cgpa based on some empirical research(unpublished), i'll like to ask that are there enough proofs to say that high cgpas guarantee a successful manager? One of our profs actually said that there's none based on "some studies", which again are unpublished.
      #405 • 03 Feb '12 Like
    • first_timer *the number of applicants they interview is still more or less the same
      #406 • 03 Feb '12 Like
    • proxyperson Instead of complaining or contemplating we first need to widen our vision and undertanding.All that the IIMs wish to do is to pick the best of the lots for their coveted PG courses.People whove earned GD/PI/WAT calls from IIMs deserved it coz, (a)they were consistent academic performers and so theres no doubt on them being hard working(as long as the academics were achieved with all the fair means only) (b)they scored above the minimum CAT cutoffs and hence testified that they are good at basic maths,reasoning,interpretation and verbal which a manager should have (c)in their respective categories,i.e. op,sc,st,obc etc.,they were the most eligible bunch of people satisfying criterion (a) and (b).I strongly believe that the reservation policy has some deep flaws,but even then it is socially essential for sustained overall national growth.Aspirants must get things straight that if there are 200 seats,100 only are availavle for general category guys.They should only focus on earning one of those 100 seats by competing among themselves without wasting their useful energies in brooding over where the remaining 100 is going.Remember,not everyone from reserved categories who appear for CAT gets a call!!!!!!! --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Then,through GD/PI/WAT their employability,suitability and skills as a prospective manager would be scrutinized.In general,no one who doesnt deserve an IIM seat would get it,and this alone is the single most important motif that any kind of an admission procedure envisages.Now,that doesnt mean that everybody who couldnt get an IIM call dint deserve to get it at all.But,everyone cannot be shortlisted,right?somewhere there has to be a line and there would be of the likes who would fall just short.Thats how it always is.
      #407 • 03 Feb '12 Like
    • Wizkidd @ Apurv - Chillax man.... :),Plz try to look into the logic others are presenting rather then just defending your logic. I hope you don't take my comments personally. I agree consistent performers are better but shouldn't we believe in 2nd chances...Majority of students in the last decade didn't know the real importance of the Board examinations, as they have learned it now the hard way.Still scoring a 70-75 % in those exams does not mean that you are dumb.Agreed that all the foreign Ivy league B skols take in account you past performance but there is a humongous difference between there method of teaching which is more practicality based than ours which is more theory based(helps muggers :D and i know all toppers are not muggers but majority of them are).So we should not really compare them. Secondly, companies are preferring candidates with consistent performers but shouldn't the Best B Skols look beyond placements and try and create good managers.They already have Brand images - do not need placements, and still companies will goto recruit there.They need talented people. 'One time wonders' and read GK etc.. even that requires hard work.although am not at all in favor of people creating a passionate hobby overnight.But these things are Smart work and that is what I suppose Managers are required to do.As soon as one realizes the importance of MBA they do work hard eventually to make it big. And finally - Scoring a Century against Pakistan in a WC final will always be deemed better then double tons against Canada and UAE :P.
      #408 • 03 Feb '12 Like
    • Keys Will the IITs and other institutes (of any discipline) start giving weightage to 10th n 12th marks? Management is a great degree to have but so too are the rest. Imagine what will happen if IITs or anyother college for that matter start taking 10th marks (not 12th, that is more controllable at that time). Students would be in a dilemma wont they? I hope not. And if my understanding of law is right, any act committed before a law is passed recognizing such acts as a crime; that act is not a crime purely because the person accused never knew about such a law because such a law dint exist! Now, i took "crime and law" which can be replaced with "acads and rules/criteria". I never knew IIMs existed when i was in 10th. And when in 12th i was more concerned about my grad. Heck, i wasnt even an adult to know of all of these things at that time! These criterias were introduced in 2009, i believe. I finished my 12th long before that. It's not fair. Simple. After shortlisting a person or accepting the 1400 bucks , you ought to give him at least a decent chance of winning. the criteria while applying for CAT was simply 60% in grads. You cannot later say that "sorry, we cannot take you cos of something you did while enjoying your childhood". you decide.
      #409 • 03 Feb '12 Like
    • Keys With intro of CCE and making 10th boards optional, what's the IIM gonna do now? :D "Sorry, cant let you in cos the other guy had more guts and took the boards while you dint"
      #410 • 03 Feb '12 Like
    • Keys But Apurv, you did a decent job. Nice article. I hope you got your facts right cos I cant verify it anyway :) Every view must find space. I don't necessarily agree with what you have written but thanks for presenting your views as clearly as you could. :)
      #411 • 03 Feb '12 Like
    • Keys "The following 356 users Say NO Thank You for this Un-useful Post" no post is un useful. especially one that has generated 400-odd comments :) somebody change that! :D
      #412 • 03 Feb '12 Like
    • savya888 @apurv i agree consistency should be rewarded.. but the iim system is flawed.. what u did was made an assumption that is "the step in right direction.." and proceeded with defending the iim system of admitting students after cat.. you could have easily stated the pros and cons of the system.. anyways.. you say a hit and run performance in CAT should not be rewarded.. i agree completely.. but what about the candidates who had a normal day on the CAT exam (who really worked hard and scored 98+ with balanced sectionals) but had one or two bad days.. (illness,family tragedy,etc) 7-8 years back.. in his Xth or XII exam.. you think he should never get a chance into IIMs?? because the criteria sure says so.. why not give a GD PI/WAT call everybody who clears the CAT cut off.. and then at least meet the candidate Face to Face.. and give him a chance to defend/explain his low acads.. that way.. the lucky ones, the hit and runs would be eliminated..and only candidate genuinely hardworking and oriented towards the business world will be selected.. why can't the IIMs do this?
      #413 • 03 Feb '12 Like
    • surajkhanna like savya888 cat 11 qa : 98.58 va : 98.72 oa : 99.48 no calls,very poor past academics
      #414 • 03 Feb '12 Like
    • Keys So lemme guess, "living in the present" has been deleted from the cliches of todays' top management institutes :D nice
      #415 • 03 Feb '12 Like
    • maansi29 Another perspective on the IIM shortlisting criteria debate. Even corporates are demanding greater diversity in business schools - http://goo.gl/9ePWn
      #416 • 03 Feb '12 Like
    • Apurv Entire sentences have been lifted from this article in that gyancentral article. Lol.
      #417 • 03 Feb '12 Like
    • WTH Mandira Popat, the author of that article is a NMIMS graduate and worked with several FMCG majors! Such blatant plagiarism! Bamboozling.
      #418 • 03 Feb '12 Like
    • vivekmohit lol..
      #419 • 03 Feb '12 Like
    • WTH I believe this to be a result of forced diversity. Lol
      #420 • 03 Feb '12 Like
    • Page 22 of 22  
    • Jokerr unbelievable audacity shown by her in lifting ideas and words straight off..At about herself - read "She is a social media and fashion aficionado who believes in going green." - LOL...if she had atleast a puny brain and ability to convey ideas in her own terms it would have been lot more worthy than being fashion aficionado who believes in going green !
      #421 • 03 Feb '12 Like
    • Apurv More articles on that site are rehashes of PG articles. Anyway, seem like a bunch of misdirected kids running it, they'll learn sooner or later in life. Chapter closed.
      #422 • 03 Feb '12 Like
    • axt Dear Apurva, just one point, do you personnaly know any successful entrepreuneer who has grades over 90 % X th standard onwards. May be the IIMA, IIMS, IIMK,IIMI, IIMB want to have academicians. let them have it,. Go to other institutes, who value a alert and sharp mind, delivering under pressure, who can go beyond prescribed syllabus. My emphasis... BEYOND PRESCRIBED SYLLABUS..
      #423 • 03 Feb '12 Like
    • Simplyenigmatic Just a thought... When we have global evaluation agencies which can evaluate the academic credentials for the educational institutes abroad, why can't we have such independent agencies for the normalization of academic performances across universities in India, that can be used to measure candidacy?
      #424 • 03 Feb '12 Like
    • Apurv That's a good point. Globally, CGPA is the standard as it shows where you stood in class regardless of how strict/lenient your board/university's evaluation was. That's a fair measure, considering that all b-schools want to know is how competitive you were in an academic environment. But for this our boards and universities have to be increasingly computerised and connected so that such data operations can be performed.
      #425 • 03 Feb '12 Like
    • rahul4 @Apurv-Pasting your answer's extract to my post..just so that you can remember ..since lots of posts going on here...:) BY Apurv--> @rahul4 Generalising on the basis of exceptions is a logical fallacy. Apurv..dont you think thats where we go wrong..calling talented sportspersons,creative people,and high performing people from other areas apart from Academics...calling all of them as "Exceptions".And the 90+% people as the potential serious candidates...if you look...there are a lot of talented people around..who are not good at academics..but we have termed them as "exceptions" and have considered them not worthy of a premier Management education...whereas i see...most of the globally reputed b-schools consider them at par with academically brilliant students to be considered for Management education..Thats really sad stuff....Expecting your reply to this Apurv..
      #426 • 04 Feb '12 Like
    • Apurv @rahul4 - I agree that the IIM selection criteria should evolve to accommodate such people too. But you should also realise that if this is the direction they went in overnight without a minimum work-ex criteria, then they will find only 10, maybe 20 people with such exceptional backgrounds because whether it is US or India, 2.5 lakh people cannot achieve so much by the age of 20. The rest will still have to be admitted based on past acads because that is the only measure to prove consistent performance for that age. So while the problem you bring up is legit, finding a way to accommodate these few does not really solve the problem for the rest. Even if the IIMs took the minimum work-ex requirement up to 2 years and admit people with exceptional work-ex, there will still be people protesting that they were 'late bloomers' to realise that they had taken up the wrong jobs, or blame it on recession or high unemployment rates. There is no end to this, because our generation has been brought up to believe that one entrance exam can change our destinies and if an entrance were to be similarly introduced for those at the age of 40, they will still protest that they have had it unfair in the last 4 years for various reasons. This entitlement had to change someday, so that the best opportunities go to those who have started earlier than the rest, for whatever reasons. I believe that rewarding of past achievements, both academic and non-academic should continue and work experience should also be valued subjectively. Though I hope everybody realises that if work experience were to be valued more, then the chances of everybody landing up in the IT industry reduce because of the limitations involved in building a exceptional and differentiated profile in this industry in today's date in just 2 years. Secondly, it is a misconception that top global b-schools consider super-achievers on par with academically brilliant students. It is impossible to get through Stanford today without exceptional academics, because your competitors are those with equally amazing work-experience, achievements as you AND great academics, no matter what country they are from. The problem happening there is that the world has become so competitive, that those with poor acads but exceptional work experience may score a GMAT 730, but still not get through because the competition has people with exceptional work-ex and achievements, a 730 AND good acads too. When admission committees have the luxury of getting people who are everything that you are AND more (good acads), why should they not choose them over you? Every school worth its salt wants to admit students who they are sure will be able to complete the course-work of MBA in the first place. Be careful about bringing up global schools without fully having researched the nuances of admissions there these days. Of course, as you go to lower schools in the US the criteria relax on various fronts.
      #427 • 04 Feb '12 Like
    • rahul4 @Apurv--Youve made an assumption here...if a school kid..in his 10th or 12th....represents his state in sports...are you considering this as a work ex?...please tell me how?...Another point..i have done my Research..just a case in point..there is a guy...in STANFORD GSB..Currently studying there..who is a BA in DRAMA...and has been working in an advertising agency...He is in stanford..among other students from MIT,Cornell,etc etc...so?..The point im trying to make is....Dont Judge a person by his 10th and 12th standards..this is ridiculuos as per my point of view..Infact since you mentioned STANFORD...They dont even look at school level grades..they dont ask for any transcripts from School...I request you to please have a look at the Current students list from Stanford GSB..there a lot of students..from other backgrounds ..which dont require strong academics....And as for you said "Stringent criteria that Stanford uses"..let me paste their admission criteria i.e academic requirements below..And im pasting official Admission criteria from Stanford below. Academic Requirements --> "Many applicants worry that we may not know that lower grades in one concentration (or university; or, for international students, educational system) may be equivalent to the strongest at another. We do. However, it is not a grade point average (or rank in class, or actual grade) that is of greatest importance to us. By focusing on your achievements within context, we evaluate how you have excelled within your individual academic environment and how you have taken advantage of the opportunities available to you in your school and community." If you look at the above criteria...you would know the difference..also their class of MBA students actually reflects this criteria...and No where they have mentioned...slabs for percentages that will be given to you..like above 90%-->10 marks..i think thats too narrow minded.. The lowest GMAT score accepted by Stanford this year is -530.Now all of us would agree thats abysmally low.But still he/she got into Stanford..Now a 530 GMAT score is a big big dent on your academic background...But that person got through Stanford...so The arguement that these IVY league B-shools are very stringent and all...and that only super-intellecutal with high scores throughout academic life get through...Thats NOT the case here and thats been proved...I agree with one of your statements that Admissions should be subjective...But your arguement of getting excellent 10th 12th and high percentages in graduation ..according to me is not the right way...If a person does not like to Mug up and study but is gud..in Say..Sports or arts or say Just individual subjects like Maths ,Physics....Why is he considered below par than all those who Get high percentages...ur reply?
      #428 • 04 Feb '12 Like
    • Apurv @rahul4 - ALL top international schools write that sort of stuff to position the school in a certain way to the outside world and widen their applicant pool as much as possible from many countries and cultures, so that nobody assumes anything and not apply. You can learn stated policies by reading a text but you can't understand how the process works in the real world by reading websites, just as you can't understand how the government actually works by reading the constitution. There are also strange things you write like "there a lot of students..from other backgrounds ..which dont require strong academics", whatever that means, and many other misinterpretations of what you've read on that website. Not going into specifics as this is not the thread to learn about practical nuances of applying to the US. I don't have a problem at all if you think I am trying to escape the debate. Have a great weekend :D.
      #429 • 04 Feb '12 Like
    • ranbeer19 this article was written in order to make a record of groans and comments. I think that from all the articles till now published this article has broken all the past records of groans and comments.Mods can enlighten us regarding this record. Now for the content of this article ,the numbers speak for themselves. This trend of b schools giving high imp. on past acads is highly detrimental to the progress of management edu in india. "If mugging up requires effort" which even i accept but then where will be the tendency to think something new & out of the box . I simply ask this question to Mr. Pandit - How will new leaders who will shape the society then appear??
      #430 • 06 Feb '12 Like
    • imcoolrvid The B schools need to do away with the 'weightage' allocation and move to profile based screening and adopt a subjective approach to evaluating a candidate. The concept of just having some Z score and normalization of scores is UTTER NON-SENSE. By saying that they can judge a student by looking at his 10, 12 and graduation marks, the IIMs have indicated that they can judge a book by looking at its cover, the number of pages, and the price. The IIMs should first conduct the CAT and then allow all above 95 percentile or say 90 percentile to send their resume. A panel of experts should scan the applications based on the overall profile and not just some board or graduation marks. A guy P who got 90% in class 10 but cleared NTSE and Maths Olympiad is obviously better than the guy Q with 93% and no other achievement. A guy P who got 79% in class 12 but studied Electrical Engineering from IIT Kanpur is obviously better than the guy Q with 90% who got admission in the local Jai Maa Durga Arts College. A guy P from IIT Kanpur who got 75% but had 10 international technical paper publications and won many national level competitions during his bachelor's degree is obviously better than the guy Q from Jai Maa Durga Arts College who got 80% by copying during exams, assisted by his college. A guy P who has worked for 1 year at Microsoft or Google (having salary 1.5 lacs per MONTH) is obviously better than the guy Q who could not get a job from campussing in his college and now has 4 years of EXPERIENCE working at Om Namah Shivay Call Center (having salary of 1.5 lacs per ANNUM) Sadly, under the present circumstances, P will be rated far below Q, which is an absolute shame. P, who cleared NTSE and Olympiad, studied Electrical Engineering in IIT Kanpur, had 10 international publications and scores of national level achievements, who was a brilliant student but was not very marks oriented, WILL "NOT" GET THE IIM CALL. Q, who is a very average student and has never even thought of having a national level achievement, but studied only for the upcoming exam and did nothing else, WILL GET THE IIM CALL. This is why India is not the right place for talent. It is a direct statement that only mug-up-and-vomit-out attitude is respected in India. And yes, the IIMs have STANDARDIZED the prayer for all GEMs (General Engineer Males) of the country--- "AGLE JANAM MOHE BITIYA HI KIJO"....
      #431 • 07 Feb '12 Like
    • jishnu.royc An opinion article... Fine! But I am sorry to say that I cant agree with majority of the points expressed in this article in order to support the opinion.
      #432 • 08 Feb '12 Like
    • EnggNeo Mr. Apruv, before writing about a system or procedure please analyse it properly. I agree that diversity is indeed required in B-Schools. I also agree to a certain extent that consistent acads and good score in entrance exam will generally mean that the person is hard-working, intelligent and capable enough to survive the grills of a B-School, but this comes with a rider. B-Schools are not only about churning out PGs, they are about churning out managers and leaders - and most probably in the real world it will not be ur acads that will help you. It will be your negotiations skills, out of the box thinking skills, etc. that will help you, and for sure great acads don't guarantee these skills. Second even if you agree with acad based admission criteria(I would prefer to call it filtering and rejection criteria), then how will you justify a person with 99+ percentile, 90/92 % in 10/12 (ISC) and 79% in grads not getting a call from IIMA, IIMB, IIMS, IIMI and IIMK. In fact IIMK filtering criteria was so rubbish that even a candidate with 100 percentile and 90/92 % in 10/12 (ISC) would not have got an interview call :) The grand daddy - IIMA takes it one step ahead. cut-off at 80% (for 3 points) for 10/12 and grad. and multiply all of them. So a person A with 90+ in 10/12 and 80 in grad gets a total of 27 points and B with 95+ in 10/12 and 79 in grads gets a total of 18. If this is not rubbish then what is???? And lastly when you are taking past acads into count how can you just weed out people based on 1-2 % difference. It would have been better if for GD-PI shortlist they would have also asked candidates to list out their extra-curricular activities details (really good one, not something like won school quiz in 5th class :) ), other social activities, or achievements and then call the students for PIs. This is in fact the way international B-Schools call their candidates. They ask for a complete profile in the applications, including SOPs, LORs, list of achievements and acads. They consider all of this before filtering out the candidates. They are not acad heavy, and inspite of IIMs best effort at diversity, only 5-6 % of class are women, whereas international schools have 20-30 % women. Truth is that even the IIMs cannot stand in front of top International B-Schools - because IIMs focus just of acads (for admission as well as inside the institute) and on testing whether the students can continue working with 3-5 hours of sleep, whereas these top international B-schools focus on overall development of the person, they strive to churn out leaders, not just ordinary managers or PGs. Hope from next time around you will really analyze the process about which you are writing and then only write about it - rather then just blindly taking a side. Thanks
      #433 • 14 Feb '12 Like 1
    • yogendra1 Apurv's view is the same as IIMs and this points out why IIMs are stressing so much on past acads, but personally I think subjective analysis of student's profile will be a logical method. But very difficult to implement considering huge number of people taking CAT. Say 2 lakh student appear for CAT and we keep cutoff 95% - then even screening of 10,000 profile is a harculine task ! No matter how correct/wrong is the criteria, we can never change it :D
      #434 • 18 Mar '12 Like
    • addots a good one! but only one argument that may weaken the tance- few people definitely are driven by a specific subject interest which may turn out to b their passion.this naturally pushes them to work hard(and with more fun)..the type1 type of person u mentioned in the begining. the best example being "pagal guy" founder!!! few but significant is their numbers,enough to create a difference!!
      #435 • 29 Jan Like
    • Keys this is something i came across. pretty valid i think. In fact it is a counter to what Apurv has written

      http://mbabug.com/2012/to-merit-a-comeback.html
      #436 • 30 Jan Like
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